View Full Version : Aliens can't hear us
Strong
28-01-2010, 05:55 AM
This perhaps explains why we have yet to detect alien life on other planets.
Article: Guardian - Aliens can't hear us, says astronomer (http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2010/jan/27/aliens-cant-hear-us-astronomer)
I guess it makes sense.
Cryren8972
28-01-2010, 06:29 AM
Maybe they don't have ears.
Always like reading the reader's comments on things like this...
There bloody well is stuff flying around, I was driving back from the pub one night and there was some mad animals going skitz in a field by the church and trhere was lights and stuff. And before you start they weren't squirrels or nothing cos they were too big like gorillas or bears but they don't exist in Britain so it wasn't stuff like that. I was crapping it and I floored my van but I ain't some woofter so I was gonna come back with a twelve and see them out but my bird had a go so in the end I went to bed
Muddy
28-01-2010, 07:11 AM
Maybe they don't have ears.
That's what I thought the article was going to say!
Muddy
28-01-2010, 07:13 AM
Always like reading the reader's comments on things like this...
There bloody well is stuff flying around, I was driving back from the pub one night and there was some mad animals going skitz in a field by the church and trhere was lights and stuff. And before you start they weren't squirrels or nothing cos they were too big like gorillas or bears but they don't exist in Britain so it wasn't stuff like that. I was crapping it and I floored my van but I ain't some woofter so I was gonna come back with a twelve and see them out but my bird had a go so in the end I went to bed
That's hilarious! What does "my bird had a go" mean?
Strong
28-01-2010, 07:19 AM
Read it as "my girl friend/female partner and I had an argument", she won after he crapped himself again no doubt. At least that's the gist of it.
The bit where he was, "gonna come back with a twelve", is puzzling. I can only imagine he meant a twelve gauge shot gun, but where would he get one of those from?
Muddy
28-01-2010, 07:21 AM
I assumed that a 12 gauge is what he meant too.
I was thinking he'd come back with another 12 beers to add to the 24 he seems to have had already.
Strong
28-01-2010, 07:45 AM
Well it seems we have concluded he was breaking the law in one way or another, either being drunk in charge of a vehicle, or carry a lethal weapon, while under the influence of an inadequate brain. :sqwink:
Well it seems we have concluded he was breaking the law in one way or another, either being drunk in charge of a vehicle, or carry a lethal weapon, while under the influence of an inadequate brain. :sqwink:
Elementary!
...Which brings another topic to mind. I saw Sherlock Holmes (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0988045/) over the past weekend and was curious about what you thought of it, Strongy.
IMO, it was a bit over the top, but expected, since it was a Robert Downey Jr. film.
Have you seen it?
Strong
28-01-2010, 07:58 AM
Maybe they don't have ears.
We do make the assumption that aliens would be like us and have the same senses don't we. But of course owls hear in 3D and can pinpoint where a sound comes from, even if the source of that sound is hidden. Our hearing is much more limited.
I strongly suspect that this is actually a non-issue, as select transmitters will have special authority to send high power signals specifically for ET searching.
Muddy
28-01-2010, 08:50 AM
"For good measure, in America we have switched from analogue to digital broadcasting and you are going to do the same in Britain very soon," Drake added. "When you do that, your transmissions will become four times fainter because digital uses less power."
So for the time being at least, when the aliens do attack, we know who they'll attack first!
Muddy
28-01-2010, 08:51 AM
We do make the assumption that aliens would be like us and have the same senses don't we.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2010/jan/26/what-aliens-look-like
Strong
28-01-2010, 11:36 AM
Elementary!
...Which brings another topic to mind. I saw Sherlock Holmes (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0988045/) over the past weekend and was curious about what you thought of it, Strongy.
IMO, it was a bit over the top, but expected, since it was a Robert Downey Jr. film.
Have you seen it?
I've not seen the whole movie, only clips. It seems to me they have gone for the big show piece action movie scenes to try and attract a younger audience. But Sherlock Holmes was never an action adventure for me, they were detective stories. I'll give it a watch to see what the fuss is about and how they have updated the story. At least they have gone for British actors for the main roles, I can't imagine anyone else really. I have a feeling that the actors come across as being too young for the parts, my image of Holmes and Watson are of older men.
No doubt in the future there will be a lesbian remake. I would look out in the porn press for the remake of In the Study in Scarlet (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Study_in_Scarlet) :sqwink:
Strong
28-01-2010, 11:44 AM
http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2010/jan/26/what-aliens-look-like
Lord Rees, the president of the Royal Society and Astronomer Royal, said such a discovery would be a moment which would change humanity.
It would change our view of ourselves and our place in the cosmos, he said.
His comments come as scientists gather in London for an international conference to discuss the prospect of discovering extra-terrestrial life.
"Were we to find life, even the simplest life, elsewhere that would clearly be one of the great discoveries of the 21st Century.
"I suspect there could be life and intelligence out there in forms that we can't conceive.
"And there could, of course, be forms of intelligence beyond human capacity, beyond as much as we are beyond a chimpanzee," he added.
Article: BBC News - Astronomers hopeful of detecting extra-terrestrial life (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/8478033.stm)
We haven't found any yet! Nobody really knows at present, it is all speculation at this stage.
pctec
28-01-2010, 07:14 PM
We can do one of two things to get their attention...
1. Make a hell of a lot more noise...
2. Get our babes to lie tits up all over the planet :D
I prefer option 2
maybe they are just a pack of deaf fucks.
Muddy
01-02-2010, 03:10 PM
Maybe they're just a truck full of deft pachyderms.
They'll probably be silicon-based, and when they land in D.C. to make overtures of friendship, we'll kill them all, and you'll be able to find necklaces and earrings made of alien exoskeleton on E-Bay.
'Cause that's the way we roll down here, yo! :3wink:
tsdesigns
01-02-2010, 04:30 PM
Always like reading the reader's comments on things like this...
"I was driving back from the pub one night". What is wrong with this sentence?
ps "my bird had a go" = "my girlfriend/wife/whatever started nagging me"
Muddy
01-02-2010, 04:37 PM
"my bird had a go" = "my girlfriend/wife/whatever started nagging me"
That's poetic. Gonna have to use that.
"I was driving back from the pub one night". What is wrong with this sentence?
ps "my bird had a go" = "my girlfriend/wife/whatever started nagging me"
Thought I'd try my hand at a translation:
:3biggrin:
There bloody well is stuff flying around,
I do believe there are flying creations of which we know nought as yet.
I was driving back from the pub one night
On my return journey from the tavern one evening,
and there was some mad animals going skitz in a field by the church
there were rabid animals making the mostly beastly noises, in a field by the church
and trhere was lights and stuff.
accompanied by illuminations and ghostly effervescence.
And before you start they weren't squirrels or nothing cos they were too big like gorillas or bears
You may discount my story before I scarcely begin, but these beings of undetermined species were not unlike large primates, or other bulky bipedal mammal,
but they don't exist in Britain so it wasn't stuff like that.
although such creatures are not of these shores so my eyes must have deceived me.
I was crapping it and I floored my van
I felt in need of using Mr.Thomas Crapper (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Crapper)'s excellent device, so pushed my carriage onward at great speed.
but I ain't some woofter so I was gonna come back with a twelve
As I am not a homosexual, I had planned on returning with a large firearm
and see them out
and lay siege to the abomination near the kirk with my weapon,
but my bird had a go
but my good lady wife was made giddy with all the confusion and excitement.
so in the end I went to bed
Ultimately we alighted from our transport and laid down in our chamber perchance to dream.
:alien:
Muddy
03-02-2010, 10:12 PM
Now if that doesn't bring Watley barrelin' in here I don't know what will.
Strong
04-02-2010, 04:32 AM
Artful use of the mother tongue!
pctec
05-02-2010, 02:36 PM
On the alien thing...
I think we should pick a date and exact time... When that date and time comes, we all go outside and yell at the top of our lungs.
It just could get their attention :)
And if it doesn't, its a great stress reliever...
Cryren8972
06-02-2010, 07:01 AM
On the alien thing...
I think we should pick a date and exact time... When that date and time comes, we all go outside and yell at the top of our lungs.
It just could get their attention :)
And if it doesn't, its a great stress reliever...
Sure beats mass suicide.
pctec
06-02-2010, 07:33 AM
hehehe
You got that right... I will not drink the coolaid...
Strong
08-02-2010, 12:48 PM
The following article gives some interesting background information.
It is a good question, one that was originally posed by the Italian physicist and Nobel laureate Enrico Fermi, one of the founders of quantum physics. If intelligent life is common in the universe, we would have been contacted long ago, he argued. After all, Earth is relatively young in astronomical terms while alien civilisations elsewhere in the universe have had billions of years to rise, establish themselves and make themselves known to humanity. "So where are they?" asked Fermi.
This is Fermi's paradox and scientists – despite all their efforts – still struggle to resolve it. Much of their problem lies with the basic make-up of our galaxy, they complain. The Milky Way is an unremarkable group of stars, in a not very special part of the cosmos that contains 100bn stars, a promising enough number if seeking the odd intelligent alien, you might have thought. However, most of these stars are going to be too big, too short-lived, too hot or too cold to support planets that might sustain intelligent life, say astronomers.
Thus the hunt to find the homes of clever ETs becomes less of a steady systematic search and more of a hunt for a planetary needle in a galactic haystack. In fact, it is becoming clear that astronomers may have to search through the radio spectrums of millions of stars before we stumble on an artificial signal from an alien.
And there are other reasons why our galaxy is not alive with the sound of extraterrestrial twitter (see box on the Drake equation above). Alien life may be commonplace but rarely evolves into complex beings, for example. Planets may support life – but only the single-cell, plankton type that coat their oceans and rocks. In other words, all aliens are scum. "And let's face it, pond scum doesn't qualify as intelligent life," says Seth Shostak, chief astronomer for the Search for Extraterrestrial Intelligence (Seti), the US group dedicated to the hunt for aliens.
Article: Guardian - First contact: will we ever hear from aliens? (http://www.guardian.co.uk/culture/2010/feb/07/extraterrestrial-life-robin-mckie)
The following article gives some interesting background information.
.... "And let's face it, pond scum doesn't qualify as intelligent life," says Seth Shostak, chief astronomer....
Article: Guardian - First contact: will we ever hear from aliens? (http://www.guardian.co.uk/culture/2010/feb/07/extraterrestrial-life-robin-mckie)
I have my own theory why aliens (if they exist) haven't been in touch, and weirdly enough it involves pond scum too.
I was shocked to see that some pond scum had uploaded this video to YT:
aOba29ToH7s
If I was an intelligent extraterrestrial, I would make the intelligent choice of giving earth an extremely wide berth. To see someone treat another human like that just because they are different makes me sad.
Strong
09-02-2010, 04:26 AM
Walking, talking pond scum with a camcorder. If God did exist, you have to wonder if he/she would contemplate pressing the reset switch from time to time.
Maybe it is not such a bad thing that aliens haven't contacted us. We'd probably be wasting our time watching uploaded videos of their funny appendages with a snide narrator.
Cryren8972
09-02-2010, 06:10 AM
What I don't understand...is why people are so sure there are aliens, and then equally sure there's no God.
Strong
09-02-2010, 08:12 AM
You are absolutely right Cry, there is no evidence that either exists!
Why do I BELIEVE that aliens exist? Well we do. I know that isn't conclusive, but statistically speaking, since we exist and in a galaxy with way over 100 billion stars, most of which have planetary systems, I think we cannot be the only anomaly. Now multiply that by the number of galaxies in our Universe, which again is in the billions, and I suspect the existence of life other than ourselves is almost a given. (Of course the Universe could be playing a big joke on us, but I don't think so, it is not conscious).
We have only recently been able to detect planets around other stars. The latest count is approaching 300 known planets, mainly gas giants such as Jupiter, and far too close to their stars to accommodate life. But telescopes capable of resolving Earth sized planets will be coming on-line soon, and indeed only recently a planet only a few times larger than Earth was detected.
Looking at life on Earth, virtually everywhere we look we see evidence of life developing, even in the most inhospitable places, such as thermal vents under the sea where temperatures are 200 degrees c or more, even underneath the ice sheets in the Arctic. This suggests that life will develop where ever it can. The supposition is that a planet within a so called Goldilocks zone which is not too far and not too close to its sun, that has water, will most likely develop life. We have already detected a number of planets that lie within the 'Goldilocks' zones around their star.
I say again, you are absolutely right, there is no evidence that alien life exists, yet, but the probability that it exists is increasing.
Please note the difference between life, E.G. pond life, and intelligent life, E.G. Halo, I've specifically only made reference to life. :sqbiggrin:
Strong
09-02-2010, 08:28 AM
BTW while I believe that alien life does exist and that sooner or later we will be able to prove that, I do accept that it may not exist and that we may never prove so.
This is why I am not religious, I accept I do not know whether a God exists, but if you believe in God, you cannot at the same time accept the possibility that he does not exist, two conflicting beliefs. The implication would be that your belief is flawed if you did hold those two opposing views.
On the other hand, Darwinian evolution explains my existence far better, for me, than the existence of a deity.
Cryren8972
09-02-2010, 03:29 PM
On the other hand, Darwinian evolution explains my existence far better, for me, than the existence of a deity.
I would ask why...but I know what the answer would be. What I guess baffles me the most is...why would you rather believe one than the other? We all make those decisions in life, and we could argue both points until we're blue in the face, I just don't understand why a belief in God is attacked so rigorously, and yet all of the yet unproven science beliefs are not.
I honestly don't want to get into a religious conversation on this forum, been there done that...I'm seriously baffled.
When speaking of alien life, you're going on probabilities. My religious beliefs are also based on probabilities, and in some cases, actual events that have taken place (no, I'm not talking about the same tongue in cheek events that the Spam God guy was, but true ones). Why should I have the feeling that speaking of my faith is going to cause ridicule, on here, or anywhere for that matter....when everyone's beliefs are just that....beliefs?
Muddy
09-02-2010, 07:02 PM
I would ask why...but I know what the answer would be. What I guess baffles me the most is...why would you rather believe one than the other? We all make those decisions in life, and we could argue both points until we're blue in the face, I just don't understand why a belief in God is attacked so rigorously, and yet all of the yet unproven science beliefs are not.
I honestly don't want to get into a religious conversation on this forum, been there done that...I'm seriously baffled.
When speaking of alien life, you're going on probabilities. My religious beliefs are also based on probabilities, and in some cases, actual events that have taken place (no, I'm not talking about the same tongue in cheek events that the Spam God guy was, but true ones). Why should I have the feeling that speaking of my faith is going to cause ridicule, on here, or anywhere for that matter....when everyone's beliefs are just that....beliefs?
Has anyone (besides Ferre, LOL) ridiculed your faith on here? I hope not. If so, let me at 'em! I say, I say, let me at 'em! LOL!
What you say above makes perfect sense and I agree. As I've often said, to me God or evolution is six of one, half a dozen of the other. Believing that life came from nothing (evolution) or that life has always been here (god) both require a leap of faith. Faith is something I struggle with either way. But I'm fascinated by those that posses it. All I can figure is that their brains are wired differently than mine. What is faith?
Cryren8972
09-02-2010, 07:10 PM
Why should I have the feeling that speaking of my faith is going to cause ridicule, on here, or anywhere for that matter....when everyone's beliefs are just that....beliefs?
Has anyone (besides Ferre, LOL) ridiculed your faith on here? I hope not. If so, let me at 'em! I say, I say, let me at 'em! LOL!
What you say above makes perfect sense and I agree. As I've often said, to me God or evolution is six of one, half a dozen of the other. Believing that life came from nothing (evolution) or that life has always been here (god) both require a leap of faith. Faith is something I struggle with either way. But I'm fascinated by those that posses it. All I can figure is that their brains are wired differently than mine. What is faith?
Sorry Muddy, got carried away again. What I was saying was...I feel that I'm opening myself up to ridicule...or disdain, or constant pressure to believe another way. Not just on here, although just reading posts that aren't necessarily directed at me sometimes make me cringe, but all over. There is something about saying you're a Christian that immediately creates a reaction one way or the other.
However...if you say..."Hey, I believe in evolution", then it's supposed to go unchallenged. Even though, as you say, both are leaps of faith.
Faith IS a struggle...the pure definition of the word denotes working at believing something of which there is no tangible proof. I'm sure there are ways in which you have faith though Muddy, if you thought about it. :sqwink:
Muddy
09-02-2010, 07:37 PM
Sorry Muddy, got carried away again. What I was saying was...I feel that I'm opening myself up to ridicule...or disdain, or constant pressure to believe another way. Not just on here, although just reading posts that aren't necessarily directed at me sometimes make me cringe, but all over. There is something about saying you're a Christian that immediately creates a reaction one way or the other.
However...if you say..."Hey, I believe in evolution", then it's supposed to go unchallenged. Even though, as you say, both are leaps of faith.
Faith IS a struggle...the pure definition of the word denotes working at believing something of which there is no tangible proof. I'm sure there are ways in which you have faith though Muddy, if you thought about it. :sqwink:
I suppose I should quantify that. Obviously I have faith that the sun will come up, or that what I'm listening to on the radio really is Terry Gross broadcasting from a real studio somewhere, or that radios, TVs, telephones or the internet all work the way they're supposed to (even though I really have no idea how they do, lol). But...BUT, the point is those things DO work/happen and that helps my faith. There's at least some evidence. Some will accurately say that there's evidence of evolution. This is undeniable. However I'm talking about the origin of life. POOF, out of nothing? Or has always been? I don't know of any evidence for either so those leaps of faith are tougher for me.
Muddy
09-02-2010, 07:50 PM
This country is full of supposed Christians, in fact I would think that your Christianity would be supported and embraced in most places. I'm surprised that you find people are reacting negatively to it. I'm just guessing here, but I wonder if that other side of Cry, that cynical, skeptic, reasoning, questioning, logical, open-minded side, draws you to people that are more challenging? You could of course plunge into the warm, cozy comfort of only associating with like-minded people, people totally immersed in Christianity and all that that entails, but you're not like that and I know I'm not the only one who admires you for that.
Cryren8972
09-02-2010, 07:58 PM
This country is full of supposed Christians, in fact I would think that your Christianity would be supported and embraced in most places. I'm surprised that you find people are reacting negatively to it. I'm just guessing here, but I wonder if that other side of Cry, that cynical, skeptic, reasoning, questioning, logical, open-minded side, draws you to people that are more challenging? You could of course plunge into the warm, cozy comfort of only associating with like-minded people, people totally immersed in Christianity and all that that entails, but you're not like that and I know I'm not the only one who admires you for that.
I have to say that is one of the nicest things anyone's said to me. On many levels, that touched me, thank you for saying it. :sqbiggrin:
You're right...I do enjoy a challenge. I also like to rest with like minded people from time to time. :sqlaugh:
Strong
10-02-2010, 05:26 AM
I would ask why...but I know what the answer would be. What I guess baffles me the most is...why would you rather believe one than the other? We all make those decisions in life, and we could argue both points until we're blue in the face, I just don't understand why a belief in God is attacked so rigorously, and yet all of the yet unproven science beliefs are not.
I honestly don't want to get into a religious conversation on this forum, been there done that...I'm seriously baffled.
When speaking of alien life, you're going on probabilities. My religious beliefs are also based on probabilities, and in some cases, actual events that have taken place (no, I'm not talking about the same tongue in cheek events that the Spam God guy was, but true ones). Why should I have the feeling that speaking of my faith is going to cause ridicule, on here, or anywhere for that matter....when everyone's beliefs are just that....beliefs?
I can't speak for others, only for myself. I like sharing thoughts with others and reading what they think. I try not to ridicule people but accept them for who they are. At school I went through the religious indoctrination given to all children in the UK in the 70s. I got over it :sqwink:
This place would be very boring if everyone thought like me. Growth is always at the boundary of one's knowledge and experience. Perhaps that is why you searched us out. A view untempered by fire is weak and fragile. A forum with competing views brings with it the furnace of debate.
As for my belief in Evolution, it cannot be anything more, because the theory is not yet fully formed and tested. It has answer to many questions, but there are still gaps. It is the best theory available and for much of it there is substantiated proof.
The question of God is of a different order. There is no proof. In fact there cannot be any, we are required to BELIEVE without proof. At least that is my understanding. I can't believe in something without any evidence. With evolution, there is not a complete proof, but there is evidence that suggests it may be the answer to the question. Therefore I can bring myself to believe it. But to call it fact is premature.
Cryren8972
10-02-2010, 06:30 AM
This is something interesting to go over...it doesn't attempt to prove there is a God, but gives a very objective view of the PROBLEM of proving there's a God. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proof_that_God_exists
Some would say that our mere existance is proof enough. I understand, to the intelligent crowd how this would be questioned...I've questioned it myself, until the past few years. The more I tried to prove there WASN'T one...the more convinced I became there WAS one. Giving me credit enough to lend validity to at least a fundamental intelligence level, even though what I believe is beyond what you, yourself believe is very flattering, and I thank you. =)
I have no desire to change anyone's mind, but I do feel that I owe it to myself and my own personal beliefs to at least defend my position. Although being put on the defensive can be uncomfortable for me sometimes. I love a good debate, but abhor personal attacks against my own character and intelligence. However, backing down from that sort of resistance goes against my nature and creates an unsettling feeling of letting myself down.
Thanks again Strongy for a respectful response.
Aliens can't hear us? Of course they can't, they do not as yet exist.
See, that's why there's no God. Because it does not as of yet exist.
Makes perfect sense from a scientific perspective.
So, of course the aliens aren't going to hear us, right?
So, of course the aliens aren't going to hear us, right?
What if WE don't even exist, as of yet? We might be figments of our own imagination. :sqerr:
What if WE don't even exist, as of yet? We might be figments of our own imagination. :sqerr:I doubt it, pain is just too damned painful. lol
I do not believe that we would experience any pain did we not exist.
Ok there's that strange "belief" again (i.e "I do not believe"), I wonder if it has something to do with odds?
Cryren8972
12-02-2010, 06:28 PM
Ok there's that strange "belief" again (i.e "I do not believe"), I wonder if it has something to do with odds?
or probabilities...
Yeah well aren't they the same thing?
BTW, what are the probabilities?
Think about it, what are the probabilities that aliens will detect our signals given the enormity of the universe, even if they do exist?
As it stands now, we haven't really figured out how to put it out there fast enough.
Cryren8972
12-02-2010, 06:42 PM
yes, but not being able to PROVE there are aliens hasn't deterred their efforts to try.
True, and rightly so I think. Why? Because they are out there. That is all. I can feel them.
BTW have you visited the Christmas Barn up in good ole Vermont? It's quite a place and has absolutely nothing to do with God or what we've been discussing thus far, I'm sorry.
lol
yes, but not being able to PROVE there are aliens hasn't deterred their efforts to try.
The willingness of some, to attempt to prove their theories, is behind most of our advances, to date.
The earth is flat... flight is restricted to the birds... the stars are beyond our reach...all considered to be quackery, 'til someone that refused to listen to the "popular wisdom" proved them to be false.
Cryren8972
12-02-2010, 07:03 PM
The willingness of some, to attempt to prove their theories, is behind most of our advances, to date.
The earth is flat... flight is restricted to the birds... the stars are beyond our reach...all considered to be quackery, 'til someone that refused to listen to the "popular wisdom" proved them to be false.
I don't think anyone should be deterred from trying to prove something they believe in. Not what I intended my post to imply.
Ok I may have had a little bit much to drink, but that is no reason to come in here and start making sense, now please cut it out. Thank you.
What do I think? I think that we should start scrutinizing the internet, after all, what's more important? Let's get on a mission, scrutinize the internet at all costs. This is important, it's for the good of our offspring.\
Ok j/k but I('m kinda glad that I won't be around for the real craziness, oh unfounded
Ok I just had a look at that last post and have come to the conclusion that thAt is just crazy, n/m.
I don't think anyone should be deterred from trying to prove something they believe in. Not what I intended my post to imply.
I didn't think that you were implying that at all. What I posted was in support of what you had said. :sqwink:
Jeesuz I sure am glad that you two know what you're talking about, it gives me a warm fuzzy sorta feeling. lol
Strong
13-02-2010, 06:42 AM
What if WE don't even exist, as of yet? We might be figments of our own imagination. :sqerr:
Technically speaking, if we have imaginations to have figments, surely we must exist already in some capacity? :sqconfused:
You seem to be putting the chart before the horse Doc.
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